Go Back   Trackpads Community > General Discussions > Point/Counterpoint

Point/Counterpoint Debate newsworthy and other 'hot-button' topics here. If it can be debated, this is the forum for it. Can't be thin skinned - people will disagree with you. No flaming or personal attacks.

Point/Counterpoint

Reply
 
LinkBack Thread Tools
Old 02-05-2007, 09:36   #1 (permalink)
NCO
 
leobold1's Avatar
My Awards Rack
Silver Staff Service Medal Silver Reputation  Medal Silver Commanders Coin Marine Corps Service Button Army Service Button Bronze Community Medal 1 Blue Star Silver Threads Medal 
Total Awards: 8
My Mood
My Mood:
Status
leobold1 is offline
Post Count
4,795
My Photos
My Photos: 17
Staff Title
Moderator Commander
Member Flags
United States us texas
My Referrals
My Referrals: 0
Personal Guestbook
Reputation +/-
leobold1 has much to be proud ofleobold1 has much to be proud ofleobold1 has much to be proud ofleobold1 has much to be proud ofleobold1 has much to be proud ofleobold1 has much to be proud ofleobold1 has much to be proud ofleobold1 has much to be proud ofleobold1 has much to be proud ofleobold1 has much to be proud ofleobold1 has much to be proud of
Social Networking View Member's YouTube Profile
Other Swag
T-Bucks: 12,966.36
Bank: 157,410.06
Total T-Bucks: 170,376.42
     

 
Default Court-Martial Looms for War Objector

My Way News - Court-Martial Looms for War Objector

Feb 5, 3:10 AM (ET)

By MELANTHIA MITCHELL

SEATTLE (AP) - Anti-war activists consider 1st Lt. Ehren Watada a hero for his refusal to go to Iraq. The Army accuses him of betraying his fellow soldiers.

At a court martial Monday at Fort Lewis, south of Seattle, the 28-year-old faces four years in prison if convicted on one count of missing movement and two counts of conduct unbecoming an officer for refusing to ship out with his unit, the 3rd Brigade, 2nd Infantry Division.

Watada has spoken out against U.S. military involvement in Iraq, calling it morally wrong and a breach of American law.

"As the order to take part in an illegal act is ultimately unlawful as well, I must as an officer of honor and integrity refuse that order," Watada said in a video statement released at a June 7 news conference.

Despite having already been charged, he spoke out again in August, at a Veterans for Peace rally in Seattle.

"Though the American soldier wants to do right, the illegitimacy of the occupation itself, the policies of this administration, and the rules of engagement of desperate field commanders will ultimately force them to be party to war crime," Watada said then.

Watada and his Honolulu attorney, Eric Seitz, contend his comments are protected speech, but Army prosecutors argued his behavior was dangerous to the mission and morale of other soldiers.

"He betrayed his fellow soldiers who are now serving in Iraq," Capt. Dan Kuecker said at one hearing. Kuecker has not commented on the case outside of court.

Seitz unsuccessfully sought an opportunity to argue the legality of the war, saying it violated Army regulations that specify wars are to be waged in accordance with the United Nations charter. His final attempt was quashed last month when the military judge, Lt. Col. John Head, ruled Watada cannot base his defense on the war's legality. Head also rejected claims that Watada's statements were protected by the First Amendment.

The Army had subpoenaed two journalists who interviewed Watada, drawing criticism from free-press advocates, but that fell by the wayside as prosecutors dropped two of the four counts of misconduct in exchange for Watada admitting he made statements to freelance journalist Sarah Olson and Greg Kakesako of the Honolulu Star-Bulletin.

Military law experts said that, by confining themselves to the missing movement charge, prosecutors might have saved themselves from arguing some of the legal issues relating to free speech.

"It's desirable that they're abandoning the path of using reporters as witnesses," said Eugene Fidell, president of the National Institute of Military Justice in Washington, D.C. "It's a very toxic strategy."

Fidell wasn't surprised the government rejected a deal offered by Seitz that would have had Watada serve only three months confinement with a dishonorable discharge.

"Why should they? He missed a movement of his unit," he said. "No army can tolerate officers refusing to move with their unit."

---

On the Net:

Watada supporters: Thank You Lt. Watada - BREAKING NEWS
__________________
Compel others: Do not be compelled by them
Sun-Tzu



leobold1 is offline  
Digg this Post!Add Post to del.icio.usBookmark Post in TechnoratiFurl this Post!
Reply With Quote
Trackpads Information
Click to Visit
Old 02-05-2007, 15:52   #2 (permalink)
Monkey Mouse
 
Woodmonkey's Avatar
My Awards Rack
Gold Staff Service Medal Gold Reputation Medal Bronze Referrals Medal Bronze Magazine Medal Silver Gallery Medal Gold Donations Award Silver Donations Award 2 Blue Star 
Total Awards: 12
My Mood
My Mood:
Status
Woodmonkey is offline
Post Count
58,366
My Photos
My Photos: 108
Staff Title
Trackpads XO
Member Flags
United States us connecticut
My Referrals
My Referrals: 15
Personal Guestbook
Reputation +/-
Woodmonkey has a reputation beyond reputeWoodmonkey has a reputation beyond reputeWoodmonkey has a reputation beyond reputeWoodmonkey has a reputation beyond reputeWoodmonkey has a reputation beyond reputeWoodmonkey has a reputation beyond reputeWoodmonkey has a reputation beyond reputeWoodmonkey has a reputation beyond reputeWoodmonkey has a reputation beyond reputeWoodmonkey has a reputation beyond reputeWoodmonkey has a reputation beyond repute
Petz
Other Swag
T-Bucks: 97,391.17
Bank: 1,395,289.83
Total T-Bucks: 1,492,681.00
     
     
     

 
Default Re: Court-Martial Looms for War Objector

I hope this cowardly sleeze is found guilty and actually serves some hard time. I also hope that he gets a dishonorable discharge.
__________________
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
How May I Help You?





PM me through this link if clicking on those banners doesn't help with your questions

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Woodmonkey is offline  
Digg this Post!Add Post to del.icio.usBookmark Post in TechnoratiFurl this Post!
Reply With Quote
Old 02-05-2007, 17:22   #3 (permalink)
Non-Commissioned Officer
 
m60-gunner's Avatar
My Awards Rack
2 Blue Star Army Service Button 
Total Awards: 2
My Mood
Status
m60-gunner is offline
Post Count
789
My Photos
My Photos: 0
Staff Title
Trivia Game Coordinator
Member Flags
United States us iowa
My Referrals
My Referrals: 0
Personal Guestbook
Reputation +/-
m60-gunner is a splendid one to beholdm60-gunner is a splendid one to beholdm60-gunner is a splendid one to beholdm60-gunner is a splendid one to beholdm60-gunner is a splendid one to beholdm60-gunner is a splendid one to beholdm60-gunner is a splendid one to beholdm60-gunner is a splendid one to beholdm60-gunner is a splendid one to beholdm60-gunner is a splendid one to beholdm60-gunner is a splendid one to behold
Other Swag
T-Bucks: 563.30
Bank: 0.00
Total T-Bucks: 563.30

 
Default Re: Court-Martial Looms for War Objector

The man took the oath. I did'nt like everything I had to do while in service, but it was my duty. This is a time of war. Whether you like our position or not if you took the oath it is your responsabilty to uphold it, without question.
He should be exacuted by firing squad. It may seem a little over the top but I love my country. I may not agree with a lot of things it has done, but I took a oath and to me it lasts a lifetime.
__________________
Fear God, Tell the Truth, and Make Money


Don't be to optimistic. The light at the end of the tunnel might be a train!

Remember only two defining forces have ever offered to die for you,
Jesus Christ and the American Soldier.
One died for your soul, the other for your freedom. [Tony Blair]
m60-gunner is offline  
Digg this Post!Add Post to del.icio.usBookmark Post in TechnoratiFurl this Post!
Reply With Quote
Old 02-05-2007, 20:57   #4 (permalink)
Non-Commissioned Officer
 
ptco911's Avatar
My Awards Rack
Army Service Button 
Total Awards: 1
My Mood
My Mood:
Status
ptco911 is offline
Post Count
510
My Photos
My Photos: 0
Member Flags
United States us kansas
My Referrals
My Referrals: 1
Personal Guestbook
Reputation +/-
ptco911 is a jewel in the roughptco911 is a jewel in the roughptco911 is a jewel in the roughptco911 is a jewel in the roughptco911 is a jewel in the roughptco911 is a jewel in the roughptco911 is a jewel in the roughptco911 is a jewel in the roughptco911 is a jewel in the roughptco911 is a jewel in the roughptco911 is a jewel in the rough
Other Swag
T-Bucks: 6,625.10
Bank: 0.00
Total T-Bucks: 6,625.10
 

 
Default Re: Court-Martial Looms for War Objector

Ft Leavenworth USDB is looking for a few more with yellow running stripes on their backs. He belongs in prison and a dishonorable discharge after that. He is definitely a Sean Penn type leader. Speak of that rat face, he called the Courts Martial a kangaroo court.

Just another media circus for the far left. Cindy Sheehan will probably ask to adopt the coward.
ptco911 is offline  
Digg this Post!Add Post to del.icio.usBookmark Post in TechnoratiFurl this Post!
Reply With Quote
Old 02-06-2007, 03:08   #5 (permalink)
NCO
 
Manchu34's Avatar
My Awards Rack
Silver Staff Service Medal Silver Reputation  Medal Bronze Reputation  Medal Bronze Vehicle ID Medal Bronze Gallery Medal Silver Commanders Coin Silver Commanders Coin Army Service Button 
Total Awards: 12
My Mood
My Mood:
Status
Manchu34 is offline
Post Count
1,894
My Photos
My Photos: 281
Staff Title
Army Forum & Contests Moderator/Trivia Quizmaster/
Member Flags
United States us missouri
My Referrals
My Referrals: 0
Personal Guestbook
Reputation +/-
Manchu34 is a name known to allManchu34 is a name known to allManchu34 is a name known to allManchu34 is a name known to allManchu34 is a name known to allManchu34 is a name known to allManchu34 is a name known to allManchu34 is a name known to allManchu34 is a name known to allManchu34 is a name known to allManchu34 is a name known to all
Petz
Other Swag
T-Bucks: 9,218.36
Bank: 83,728.16
Total T-Bucks: 92,946.52
    

 
Default Re: Court-Martial Looms for War Objector

I think that 4 years at Leavenworth USDB will not be long enough and to good for him. What will make it worse is the fact he will go there as an officer and can not be made to do any work that an officer. such as hard labor that an enlisted/ NCO prisoner could be made to do.

Personally, I think he should be drawn, quartered, and the 4 pieces shipped to 4 different parts of the world.
__________________
Manchu34 is offline  
Digg this Post!Add Post to del.icio.usBookmark Post in TechnoratiFurl this Post!
Reply With Quote
Old 02-06-2007, 15:10   #6 (permalink)
Non-Commissioned Officer
 
ptco911's Avatar
My Awards Rack
Army Service Button 
Total Awards: 1
My Mood
My Mood:
Status
ptco911 is offline
Post Count
510
My Photos
My Photos: 0
Member Flags
United States us kansas
My Referrals
My Referrals: 1
Personal Guestbook
Reputation +/-
ptco911 is a jewel in the roughptco911 is a jewel in the roughptco911 is a jewel in the roughptco911 is a jewel in the roughptco911 is a jewel in the roughptco911 is a jewel in the roughptco911 is a jewel in the roughptco911 is a jewel in the roughptco911 is a jewel in the roughptco911 is a jewel in the roughptco911 is a jewel in the rough
Other Swag
T-Bucks: 6,625.10
Bank: 0.00
Total T-Bucks: 6,625.10
 

 
Default Re: Court-Martial Looms for War Objector

Quote:
Originally Posted by Manchu34 View Post
I think that 4 years at Leavenworth USDB will not be long enough and to good for him. What will make it worse is the fact he will go there as an officer and can not be made to do any work that an officer. such as hard labor that an enlisted/ NCO prisoner could be made to do.

Personally, I think he should be drawn, quartered, and the 4 pieces shipped to 4 different parts of the world.
I believe if convicted, he will be reduced to the rank of PVT E1, with forfeiture of all pay and allowances during the four years of the sentence and should be discharged dishonorably following that.
ptco911 is offline  
Digg this Post!Add Post to del.icio.usBookmark Post in TechnoratiFurl this Post!
Reply With Quote
Old 02-06-2007, 19:39   #7 (permalink)
Non-Commissioned Officer
 
Carnage_59's Avatar
My Awards Rack
Air Force Service Button Bronze Community Medal 
Total Awards: 2
My Mood
My Mood:
Status
Carnage_59 is offline
Post Count
1,402
My Photos
My Photos: 24
Member Flags
United States us virginia
My Referrals
My Referrals: 0
Personal Guestbook
Reputation +/-
Carnage_59 is a name known to allCarnage_59 is a name known to allCarnage_59 is a name known to allCarnage_59 is a name known to allCarnage_59 is a name known to allCarnage_59 is a name known to allCarnage_59 is a name known to allCarnage_59 is a name known to allCarnage_59 is a name known to allCarnage_59 is a name known to allCarnage_59 is a name known to all
Other Swag
T-Bucks: 2,572.88
Bank: 0.00
Total T-Bucks: 2,572.88
 

 
Default Re: Court-Martial Looms for War Objector

Quote:
Originally Posted by Manchu34 View Post
I think that 4 years at Leavenworth USDB will not be long enough and to good for him. What will make it worse is the fact he will go there as an officer and can not be made to do any work that an officer. such as hard labor that an enlisted/ NCO prisoner could be made to do.

Personally, I think he should be drawn, quartered, and the 4 pieces shipped to 4 different parts of the world.
That's not true. Sentencing for a general court-martial can remove rank all the way down to E-1, forfeiture of all pay and allowances while in USDB custody.
__________________


This says it all.
Carnage_59 is offline  
Digg this Post!Add Post to del.icio.usBookmark Post in TechnoratiFurl this Post!
Reply With Quote
Reply

Bookmarks

Thread Tools

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are On
Pingbacks are On
Refbacks are On

Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Judge blocks war objector court-martial cec Army 3 10-22-2007 13:41
Lt. Watada's New Court-martial Date las47032