Is Osama Dead?

[Woodmonkey]

Story of Bin Laden's Death Greeted by Skepticism, Doubt

PARIS -- A leaked French intelligence memo reporting that Osama bin Laden had died of illness last month caused a flurry of speculation Saturday, but skeptical French, U.S. and Arab officials said they had no information confirming the report.

French President Jacques Chirac told journalists that the intelligence report "has by no means been confirmed, not whatsoever." And a French security official cautioned that memo was based on uncorroborated intelligence from a single source.

"We are not confirming whatever has been said in this report because we consider it a source among other sources," said the French security official, who spoke on condition of anonymity. "Our services, like others around the world, don't use just one source for reaching such a conclusion, they need multiple sources. We don't think this is a reliable report at this stage."

The latest rumblings about the elusive al-Qaida leader came from an unlikely source: a small regional newspaper. L'Est Republicain, based in the eastern city of Nancy, published an article Saturday along with a copy of a confidential Sept. 21 memo from France's foreign intelligence agency, which is overseen by the Defense Ministry and known by the initials DGSE.

The memo informed the president's office and the defense minister that Saudi intelligence had "become convinced" that bin Laden was dead, according to the newspaper.

"The data gathered by the Saudis indicates that the chief of al-Qaida would have been a victim, while in Pakistan on Aug. 23, 2006, of a very strong attack of typhoid," the intelligence memo stated, according to the newspaper. "His geographic isolation, caused by his permanent fugitive status, made any medical care impossible. On Sept. 4, the Saudi security services obtained the first intelligence about his death."

As in Paris, the response in Washington, D.C., was skeptical and cautious.

"We don't have any confirmation of that report," U.S. State Department spokesman Sean McCormack told reporters.

Two U.S. intelligence officials and a knowledgeable senior official of an Arab country also tracking bin Laden said much the same thing.

The officials were slightly less skeptical about the possibility that bin Laden is gravely ill. For years, bin Laden has been rumored to be suffering from a debilitating kidney disease, perhaps requiring dialysis.

"We've been down this road many times before, and there is no reason to think that this one has any more credence than the others," the U.S. intelligence official said.

Bin Laden was last seen in a videotape released in 2004. His voice was last heard in an audiotape released June 29, in which he mourned the slaying by U.S. forces of Abu Musab al-Zarqawi, al-Qaida's kingpin in Iraq.

Spy agencies have not detected any so-called "chatter" among al-Qaida operatives or other traditional indicators of a momentous event such as bin Laden's death, officials said.

Despite the reservations about its contents, French officials did not question the authenticity of the memo itself. Chirac said he had ordered an internal investigation of the leak.

French officials said DGSE has good sources in the Arab world, and the Saudis know a lot about bin Laden.

But U.S. and Pakistani intelligence services probably would have better information because they are leading the hunt for bin Laden, a top French anti-terror official said. He said he was not aware of any increased talk among international counter-terror officials in recent days.

If the Saudi government had received hard information about bin Laden's death or imminent death, it would have gone immediately to a U.S.-Saudi counterterrorism center in Riyadh, the Saudi capital, officials said. From there, it would have been sent to Washington, D.C., within hours, the officials said, adding that no such referrals have taken place.

Bin Laden's death by a serious illness such as typhoid probably would make him as much of a martyr in the eyes of al-Qaida propagandists as being killed in battle, the second official said. He has outlasted his pursuers for a decade or so, including the five years since the Sept. 11 attacks.

The Source

[Snowden]

Spies reject ‘Bin Laden is dead’ claim

John Follain, Paris, and Christina Lamb
PRESIDENT Jacques Chirac ordered an investigation last night into the leaking of a French intelligence report that suggested Osama Bin Laden, the Al-Qaeda leader, may have died from typhoid in Pakistan last month.


The eight-line document, which was published yesterday in a French provincial newspaper, L’Est Républicain, was greeted with scepticism by security and government officials from the United States to Pakistan itself.

NI_MPU('middle');Yet the DGSE, the French secret service, had judged the report significant enough to send it on September 21 to the offices of Chirac and the prime minister, Dominique de Villepin. The report claimed that “a usually trustworthy source“ had persuaded the Saudi secret service Bin Laden was dead.

“The head of Al-Qaeda, while he was in Pakistan on August 23, 2006, reportedly suffered a very strong case of typhoid which led to a partial paralysis of his lower limbs. His geographical isolation, caused by a permanent flight, reportedly made any medical assistance impossible,“ the report said.

Intelligence of Bin Laden’s supposed death apparently reached Saudi security services on September 4. “They are said to be awaiting additional details, and in particular the exact location of his final resting place, to announce the news officially," the report said.

Chirac said after a summit with President Vladimir Putin of Russia and Angela Merkel, the German chancellor, that Bin Laden’s death had not been confirmed in any way. “I was a bit surprised to see a confidential note from the DGSE had been published,” he added. He told his defence minister to find out how it had happened.

Aftab Khan Sherpao, Pakistan’s interior minister, responded to questions about Bin Laden last night by saying: “We have no such information. I have never heard anything about this.”

Intelligence officials in America and Asia insisted they would have known about the report if it had been true, and said no such information had crossed their desks in recent days. One Washington-based official said: “I don’t think this is a piece of information that would remain secret for long — no one would have any interest in keeping it quiet.”

A source with indirect links to Al-Qaeda claimed Bin Laden had been seen alive by one of his commanders earlier this month.

Spies reject ‘Bin Laden is dead’ claim - Sunday Times - Times Online

[Snowden]

Spies reject ‘Bin Laden is dead’ claim

John Follain, Paris, and Christina Lamb




PRESIDENT Jacques Chirac ordered an investigation last night into the leaking of a French intelligence report that suggested Osama Bin Laden, the Al-Qaeda leader, may have died from typhoid in Pakistan last month.


The eight-line document, which was published yesterday in a French provincial newspaper, L’Est Républicain, was greeted with scepticism by security and government officials from the United States to Pakistan itself.

NI_MPU('middle');Yet the DGSE, the French secret service, had judged the report significant enough to send it on September 21 to the offices of Chirac and the prime minister, Dominique de Villepin. The report claimed that “a usually trustworthy source“ had persuaded the Saudi secret service Bin Laden was dead.

“The head of Al-Qaeda, while he was in Pakistan on August 23, 2006, reportedly suffered a very strong case of typhoid which led to a partial paralysis of his lower limbs. His geographical isolation, caused by a permanent flight, reportedly made any medical assistance impossible,“ the report said.

Intelligence of Bin Laden’s supposed death apparently reached Saudi security services on September 4. “They are said to be awaiting additional details, and in particular the exact location of his final resting place, to announce the news officially," the report said.

Chirac said after a summit with President Vladimir Putin of Russia and Angela Merkel, the German chancellor, that Bin Laden’s death had not been confirmed in any way. “I was a bit surprised to see a confidential note from the DGSE had been published,” he added. He told his defence minister to find out how it had happened.

Aftab Khan Sherpao, Pakistan’s interior minister, responded to questions about Bin Laden last night by saying: “We have no such information. I have never heard anything about this.”

Intelligence officials in America and Asia insisted they would have known about the report if it had been true, and said no such information had crossed their desks in recent days. One Washington-based official said: “I don’t think this is a piece of information that would remain secret for long — no one would have any interest in keeping it quiet.”

A source with indirect links to Al-Qaeda claimed Bin Laden had been seen alive by one of his commanders earlier this month.
http://www.timesonline.co.uk/article/0,,2089-2372390,00.html

[milmor_1]

"Bring me the head of Alfredo Garcia" - "Show me the Money" in other words a single unsubstantiated report is unsatisfactory we need proof positive.

While his death would be welcomed, let us NOT get fooled into thinking that his death would end Al-Qaeda, it will only mean that one problem has been surmounted any their will be many more to deal with after him.

[Woodmonkey]

Originally Posted by milmor_1

"Bring me the head of Alfredo Garcia" - "Show me the Money" in other words a single unsubstantiated report is unsatisfactory we need proof positive.

While his death would be welcomed, let us NOT get fooled into thinking that his death would end Al-Qaeda, it will only mean that one problem has been surmounted any their will be many more to deal with after him.

Yes, true. It could also mean that the heat would be off bin Ladin, IF we accepted these reports without proof and stopped the hunt.

[Scrappy]

So what if the sob is dead. We already knew where he was hiding, but it'd cost to much in political capital to go in.... that's why the Pakistani's are acting the way they are, dumb asses.