Any opinions on the NSA thing

[centra]

Collecting our numbers.

I think this case was ruled on by the Supreme court in 1979.

Supreme court.
Concerning 4th amendment rights and telephone numbers.

Judge Blackmun (liberal) says for the majority, with Judge Stevens (liberal) on his side:

The telephone company, at police request, installed at its central offices a pen register to record the numbers dialed from the telephone at petitioner's home. Prior to his robbery trial, petitioner moved to suppress "all fruits derived from" the pen register. The Maryland trial court denied this motion, holding that the warrantless installation of the pen register did not violate the Fourth Amendment. Petitioner was convicted, and the Maryland Court of Appeals affirmed.
Held:
The installation and use of the pen register was not a "search" within the meaning of the Fourth Amendment, and hence no warrant was required. Pp. 739-746.
(a) Application of the Fourth Amendment depends on whether the person invoking its protection can claim a "legitimate expectation of privacy" that has been invaded by government action. This inquiry normally embraces two questions: first, whether the individual has exhibited an actual (subjective) expectation of privacy; and second, whether his expectation is one that society is prepared to recognize as "reasonable." Katz v. United States, 389 U.S. 347 . Pp. 739-741.
(b) Petitioner in all probability entertained no actual expectation of privacy in the phone numbers he dialed, and even if he did, his expectation was not "legitimate." First, it is doubtful that telephone users in general have any expectation of privacy regarding the numbers they dial, since they typically know that they must convey phone numbers to the telephone company and that the company has facilities for recording this information and does in fact record it for various legitimate business purposes. And petitioner did not demonstrate an expectation of privacy merely by using his home phone rather than some other phone, since his conduct, although perhaps calculated to keep the contents of his conversation private, was not calculated to preserve the privacy of the number he dialed. Second, even if petitioner did harbor some subjective expectation of privacy, this expectation was not one that society is prepared to recognize as "reasonable." When petitioner voluntarily conveyed numerical information to the phone company and "exposed" that information to its equipment in the normal course of business, he assumed the risk that the company would reveal the information [442 U.S. 735, 736] to the police, cf. United States v. Miller, 425 U.S. 435 . Pp. 741-746.
http://caselaw.lp.findlaw.com/script...=442&invol=735
please read this again.
(b) Petitioner in all probability entertained no actual expectation of privacy in the phone numbers he dialed, and even if he did, his expectation was not "legitimate." First, it is doubtful that telephone users in general have any expectation of privacy regarding the numbers they dial, since they typically know that they must convey phone numbers to the telephone company and that the company has facilities for recording this information and does in fact record it for various legitimate business purposes.

If one can not expect privacy then how can many?

The echelon program everyone is taliking about.
http://www.fas.org/irp/program/process/echelon.htm

I hope this little bit of research has helped those who wonder if Bush is breaking the law concerning your 4th amendment rights. Let me know if it did.

[Snowden]

Centra, I really believe there should be a court order for wire tapping. That said, I also believe there is no such thing as privacy here any more. I hope I'm wrong.

[USA11B]

Originally Posted by Snowden

Centra, I really believe there should be a court order for wire tapping. That said, I also believe there is no such thing as privacy here any more. I hope I'm wrong.

I agree with that, no such thing as a secret either.

[m60-gunner]

It sucks! We have lost alot of privacy. But the way the world is today it is lucky that is all we lost. Alot of things have happened that we don't like or agree with and there is alot more we probbaly can't imanigne. To me there is alot of things we the public don't need to know.
As for the phone calls, if your not doing nothing wrong you don't have a problem.

[Snowden]

Originally Posted by m60-gunner

It sucks! We have lost alot of privacy. But the way the world is today it is lucky that is all we lost. Alot of things have happened that we don't like or agree with and there is alot more we probbaly can't imanigne. To me there is alot of things we the public don't need to know.
As for the phone calls, if your not doing nothing wrong you don't have a problem.

I don't have a problem insofar as doing wrong, Robert; I still don't like having the government listen in on my conversations. Not really! Some things are private; have nothing to do with anything of interest to the government or to any other government. I accept things as they are only because I can do nothing about it.

But I don't have to like it. I realize that some of my connections may have been odd or questionable - so for me personally, I would not protest. Even so, I don't like it.

If you lose your privacy, this is the first step, IMO, to losing your freedom. That old "Big Brother is watching" thing." It was one way Communism took over Russia/USSR. Do we mean to have that here?

[USA11B]

The Congressional branches, for the most part give lip service to being almost opposed to it,while doing little to stop it. The Executive branch always want more power, telling us we have nothing to fear, the information will never be used against law abiding citizens.
If I am law abiding, which I am, no government agency needs this information on me.
It is a delicate balance that has shifted too much to the collection side.

[m60-gunner]

Snowden dear you said it alot better than me. Your right just because that's the way it is, we don't have to like it. I don't like it, but I can only voice my opinion. sometimes it's straight to the point and unfeeling.
It scares me that it is really close to the rise of communissm. We all need to remember 2 things. the 2 events are what my Italian grandma told me for years, and said that people should never let it happen again. The first is Macharthyisam and the second is the Brownshirts. My grandmother lived through both and it scares the hell out of me.
I still think you said it best though, we don't have to like whats happening, but don't just blame 1 person or group, it's a mix of all of them.