Islamic fundamentalism vs. Christian fundamentalism

[Joker]

Humph, well, what to say? Does anyone feel the dogmatic 'Islamists' have their counterpart in Christian extremists who believe in the literal truth of the Bible, and a world that was created 6,000-odd years ago? That certain events 2,000 years ago changed everything, whether the Jews and Muslims believe it or not?

Does the current American administration recognise the divide between religion and the state, as typified by the Fifth Commandment being optional when the the security of the nation is at stake? If it doesn't, how can it justify pre-emptive acts of aggression against other countries? Ditto for the Anglican Prime Minister, Tony Blair?

Hands up who's (whose?) not a Christian fundamentalist around here? *

Well, enough to be going on with for now.


* Not the most approprate icon, but if they're not waving, they're employing the middle finger graphically, or making circling motions about the head... How about a straight forward 'hand in the air' smiley?

[JohnRN]

Well, I'm an atheist, so I don't think I count

[Joker]

All opinions welcome

[Woodmonkey]

Originally Posted by Joker

All opinions welcome

I'll let Snowden know....she's a good one to come in here.

For those interested in continuing the Islam vs Christian debate, Joker started "Islamic fundamentalism vs. Christian fundamentalism."

[Spec4]

As far as dogmatism goes, I'd say yes.

Christian fundamentalists may be annoying, but they are relatively harmless. Christian fundies don't go around planting bombs on trains and flying airplanes into buildings.

I do think the current administration recognizes the 5th Commandment is for "unlawful" killing, (i.e. murder) and that National Defense justifies killing.

BTW, I'm a Christian, but not a radical fundamentalist.

[Woodmonkey]

Originally Posted by Woodmonkey

I'll let Snowden know....she's a good one to come in here.

For those interested in continuing the Islam vs Christian debate, Joker started "Islamic fundamentalism vs. Christian fundamentalism."

Oh geez....I should never, never, try to post until I've gotten my first cup of coffee down. That last sentence was supposed to be in the other thread.

I'll put it there now. Sorry, Joker.

[Snowden]

By Joker:

Does anyone feel the dogmatic 'Islamists' have their counterpart in Christian extremists who believe in the literal truth of the Bible, and a world that was created 6,000-odd years ago? That certain events 2,000 years ago changed everything, whether the Jews and Muslims believe it or not?

Joker, in that they tend to take their 'book' literally, fundamentalists in any religion have certain similarities, I believe. But look at these two suras from the Qur'an and the following two from the Bible and decide which you would rather confront:

From the Qur'an:

[2.88] And they say: Our hearts are covered. Nay, Allah has cursed them on account of their unbelief; so little it is that they believe.

[2.98] Whoever is the enemy of Allah and His angels and His apostles and Jibreel and Meekaeel, so surely Allah is the enemy of the unbelievers.

From the Bible:

John 13:34 - A new commandment I give unto you, That ye love one another; as I have loved you, that ye also love one another.
Matthew 22:37 - Jesus said unto him, Thou shalt love the Lord thy God with all thy heart, and with all thy soul, and with all thy mind.
Matthew 22:38 - This is the first and great commandment.
Matthew 22:39 - And the second [is] like unto it, Thou shalt love thy neighbour as thyself.
Matthew 22:40 - On these two commandments hang all the law and the prophets.

If the Christian fundamentalists actually follow the New Testament teachings, they are pretty easy to stand. But to consider the Bible as a history book is a bit silly; it does contradict itself a bit there!

We know from science that the world is billions of years old; what was the hurry? God created it in His time - which is not measured. Infinity has neither beginning nor end; He was never under pressure to do this in a matter of a few thousand years. But it's not a belief that can cause danger to the fundys or to any of us. Oh - I don't know how to bring in a smiley with a hand up, but I'm not a fundamentalist. I'm not a Darwinian either, but I don't see evolution as contrary to Genesis or that it's of any importance.

By Joker:

Does the current American administration recognise the divide between religion and the state, as typified by the Fifth Commandment being optional when the the security of the nation is at stake? If it doesn't, how can it justify pre-emptive acts of aggression against other countries? Ditto for the Anglican Prime Minister, Tony Blair?

"Separation of church and state" is not in the Constitution, Joker - only that we do not and will not have any one church denomination (or religion, really) connected with the government as the Church of England is, with the Queen as its titular head. (And I don't really know to what extent she can make religious decisions, other than preventing her sister from marrying the divorced man she loved.)

What the current administration understands about this is difficult to say. While Bush admits to being a Christian, he hasn't made any effort to make the Methodist church of any importance despite it being the denomination he belongs to. But "separation of church and state" really isn't American law. It was a comment made in a private letter by Thomas Jefferson. Of course, it didn't remain private and has caused problems.

By Spec4:

Christian fundamentalists may be annoying, but they are relatively harmless. Christian fundies don't go around planting bombs on trains and flying airplanes into buildings.

I do think the current administration recognizes the 5th Commandment is for "unlawful" killing, (i.e. murder) and that National Defense justifies killing.

I agree.