Another G-d School Bus Accident!!!!!

[Bluehawk]

This last one was in Liberty, MO...

No dad blame seat belts... NO SEAT BELTS!

Will the mothers of America please just refuse to sleep with their husbands until the PTA, National Transportation and Safety Board, School Bus manufacturers and this United States so-called government get it through their thick skulls that SEAT BELTS ARE NECESSARY ON SCHOOL BUS!!!!

Man oh man, I am truly upset about this!!!!

Am I alone in this America?

Yes, I HAVE been trying for several years to get somebody to pay attention to this!

Will somebody in a position to DO something please do it!

[MACTANK]

Originally Posted by Wingwiper

This last one was in Liberty, MO...

No dad blame seat belts... NO SEAT BELTS!

Will the mothers of America please just refuse to sleep with their husbands until the PTA, National Transportation and Safety Board, School Bus manufacturers and this United States so-called government get it through their thick skulls that SEAT BELTS ARE NECESSARY ON SCHOOL BUS!!!!

Man oh man, I am truly upset about this!!!!

Am I alone in this America?

Yes, I HAVE been trying for several years to get somebody to pay attention to this!

Will somebody in a position to DO something please do it!

Blue you're absolutely right!

Why in the hell would a State, say Michigan for instance; advertise all over hells creation that if you don't wear a seatbelt, YOU WILL GET FINED, and than let thousands of kids ride around in a school bus on major roads without one......... Correct me if I'm wrong here, but is the driver of the bus not equipped with one?????? I believe so! Whoa Ho! What's up with that?????

[MACTANK]

Bump!

[Bluehawk]

Yet another one, this time is Jersey I think, yesterday.

Kids hurt in a relatively minor collision, of ONE little car against a huge bus... for no good reason whatsoever.

[DocDiggs]

Originally Posted by Wingwiper

Yet another one, this time is Jersey I think, yesterday.

Kids hurt in a relatively minor collision, of ONE little car against a huge bus... for no good reason whatsoever.

Here where I live in a medium sized metro area, we have about 3-4 school bus accidents per month incld. kids getting hit by cars getting on/off. Some are caused by car and pick-up drivers doing stupid things, but several have been busses running off the road into houses, stores, and stone walls! It is common for these busses to be driven by retired people with slower reflexes. Part of the problem is the manner in which busses are scheduled. For instance, if a certain bus and driver has to make two runs on differing routes, they are still expected to stick to their schedule, especially in the morning so that kids are not late to school. It is not unusual for a driver to wait extra time for a kid that is not AT the stop, but who they can see running down the walk to the bus. Multiply this by 8-9 kids and they are off schedule. A student cannot be not picked up if they are in sight and comming. Traffic jams also can result in getting off schedule. Couple these and other variables plus an older driver trying to make up time and there is a great potential for accident. Bus drivers are required to have training and special licenses, at least in most states, but even with special testing and licensing, older driver's often are just not good drivers.

It should be noted too that the largest number of car driver offenses re school busses is failure to stop for the flashing bus warning/traffic stop lights and the octagonal red stop signs that pop from the driver's side of the bus when the bus stops to let kids on/off.

The yellow busses usually have speed governors, but they do not restrict speed on residential and low speed roads. I have seen many busses over the years that are exceeding the appropriate speed for the type of roads they are on...again, often because of the tight schedule they are on. I happened to get behind the bus my older daughter was on several years ago when the driver was doing 55 in a 40 zone. As this was in the afternoon, this was particularly unnecessary, not to say unlawful. The driver came up on a traffic light that was green at that speed. The crossing road had a rather high rounded crown so that when the driver crossed it at 55, the rear wheels of the bus bounced some 6-8 inches off the pavement and came down hard. Hardly necessary to say, but I was livid with fury. I reported the driver and then made a point of following him for the next several days, but he didn't repeat.

Bus driver's also "convoy" as they leave the school grounds. This can anger car drivers who in turn often do stupid things to get past, around, between, or whatever they feel like, including pulling in front of one or more busses and breaking harder than a bus can possibly do.

While I certainly deplore school bus accidents and every time one happens I have to ask "why"? The thing is they are probably half the time because of the actions of other drivers who don't follow the rules re school busses.

When I was still teaching, the question of seat belts came up often. The response by both administration and the bus people was that in a bad accident, especially with smaller kids, belts would hinder a quick rescue because many kids may not be able to escape the belts. There was also the problem of keeping the kids IN the belts and the belts actually fastened. I still question the rationale for such as that, but seatbelts are considered and then the decision always seems to be that they are not really of help in an emergency situation.

[Bluehawk]

We can "keep kids in their seat belts" by having a policy that the school bus does not move until they are fastened in.

The rationale that seat belts do not help in an emergency is something I will be certain to announce to the stewardess and the County Mounty next time they make a point of explaining the law to me and then fining me for violating it. I'll be extra sure to refer those officials to the superior wisdom of school administrators, that oughta clear things up in a hurry

[BrianK]

I'm not anti seat belt I just have a few questions about the ability to convert the buses in service now.

These are logic based not from an mechanical engineering standpoint. Perhaps someone with more recent child transport than I would provide insight.

1. In most places do the buses transport kinder all the way through high school ? High school kids early & the same bus used later for kinder?

2. Are the backs of seats padded so that if lap belt only were provided damage to bigger kids upper body & heads wouldn't occur?

3. If seatbelts were adapted to present buses would the belt be anchored like the old fashioned way of lap belt only or include the improved shoulder restraint?

4. Smaller kids (kinder) could sit 3 to a seat would the bus driver have to assure each and every child was safely belted in to avoid a lawsuit? How would shoulder restraints be anchored to accomodate little kids?

5. The structure of a school bus from what I remember doesn't seem like the roof or side sections would support the anchoring of a shoulder harness. Would a school district to avoid a lawsuit have to segregate which buses were used for the various sized students?

6. Seems obvious to me a "fits all" belt wouldn't fit all. The floor in present buses most likely wouldn't be structurally sound to anchor that many seat belts. The roof and sides another area IMO not really capable of good restraint.

Using the up armoring of the humvees as an example, taking what is in place now and just bolting in something could be worse.

I'd opt for buses engineered/designed for safety be bought as part of a replacement fleet as the older buses were taken out od service. The additional cost could be budgeted perhaps with minimal impact on taxes.

Some of that was redundant but I was trying to include all ages and sizes.