Giant Milestone Upcoming

Next year the Giants have an important milestone coming up. We all expect
Barry to get his 715th homer early in the season, and maybe he'll get his
756th by the end of the season, but sometime in May or June there's a team
milestone coming up. Do you know what it is?
--
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'Twas Sun, 03 Oct 2004 2035 -0700 when all alt.sports.baseball stood
in awe as NFN Smith <worldoff9908@sacbeemail.com> uttered:

>> Next year the Giants have an important milestone coming up. We all expect
>> Barry to get his 715th homer early in the season, and maybe he'll get his
>> 756th by the end of the season, but sometime in May or June there's a team
>> milestone coming up. Do you know what it is?

>I know that it isn't the 10,000th franchise win. We already have that...

Hmmm. I have rechecked my sources, and I get 9,962 team victories, 38
short of 10,000. I am not a Giant fan; I was just looking at stats. Are
you saying they have already celebrated 10,000? They must be counting
something else. I guess they are counting post season games (which my
source did not). Or were the Giants in some other league before 1883?
They can't be counting preseason/exhibition games.

Anyway the milestone that the Giants can celebrate next May or June (if
they want to) is 10,000 regular season wins.
--
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Randall Bart <Barticus@att.spam.net> wrote:
> 'Twas Sun, 03 Oct 2004 2035 -0700 when all alt.sports.baseball stood
> in awe as NFN Smith <worldoff9908@sacbeemail.com> uttered:
>
>>I know that it isn't the 10,000th franchise win. We already have that...
>
> Hmmm. I have rechecked my sources, and I get 9,962 team victories, 38
> short of 10,000. I am not a Giant fan; I was just looking at stats. Are
> you saying they have already celebrated 10,000? They must be counting
> something else. I guess they are counting post season games (which my
> source did not). Or were the Giants in some other league before 1883?
> They can't be counting preseason/exhibition games.

Hmm. Well, going by baseball-reference plus this year, I also get 9,962,
but I had also thought that they had gotten their 10,000th win this year,
too. I guess they must have counted postseason games.

--Paul

Randall Bart wrote:


>
>>I know that it isn't the 10,000th franchise win. We already have that...
>
>
> Hmmm. I have rechecked my sources, and I get 9,962 team victories, 38
> short of 10,000. I am not a Giant fan; I was just looking at stats. Are
> you saying they have already celebrated 10,000? They must be counting
> something else. I guess they are counting post season games (which my
> source did not). Or were the Giants in some other league before 1883?
> They can't be counting preseason/exhibition games.

I had thought that we passed 10,000 several years ago. Or was that when
the Yankees did it, and the note that the next two franchises in line
were the Giants and (after that) the Cubs?


Related trivia question -- what's the only franchise to *lose* more than
10,000 games?

Smith

NFN Smith <worldoff9908@sacbeemail.com> wrote:
> Randall Bart wrote:
>> Hmmm. I have rechecked my sources, and I get 9,962 team victories, 38
>> short of 10,000. I am not a Giant fan; I was just looking at stats. Are
>> you saying they have already celebrated 10,000? They must be counting
>> something else. I guess they are counting post season games (which my
>> source did not). Or were the Giants in some other league before 1883?
>> They can't be counting preseason/exhibition games.
>
> I had thought that we passed 10,000 several years ago. Or was that when
> the Yankees did it, and the note that the next two franchises in line
> were the Giants and (after that) the Cubs?
>
> Related trivia question -- what's the only franchise to *lose* more than
> 10,000 games?

That's easy -- the Phillies.

--Paul

"NFN Smith" <worldoff9908@sacbeemail.com> wrote in message
news:21e9d.987$a85.745@fed1read04...
> Randall Bart wrote:
>
>
> >
> >>I know that it isn't the 10,000th franchise win. We already have
that...
> >
> >
> > Hmmm. I have rechecked my sources, and I get 9,962 team victories, 38
> > short of 10,000. I am not a Giant fan; I was just looking at stats.
Are
> > you saying they have already celebrated 10,000? They must be counting
> > something else. I guess they are counting post season games (which my
> > source did not). Or were the Giants in some other league before 1883?
> > They can't be counting preseason/exhibition games.
>
> I had thought that we passed 10,000 several years ago. Or was that when
> the Yankees did it, and the note that the next two franchises in line
> were the Giants and (after that) the Cubs?

Wasn't that home runs?

rb

'Twas Thu, 7 Oct 2004 2020 +0000 (UTC) when all alt.sports.baseball
stood in awe as Paul Lujan <plujan@QQyahooQQ.com> uttered:

>> I had thought that we passed 10,000 several years ago. Or was that when
>> the Yankees did it, and the note that the next two franchises in line
>> were the Giants and (after that) the Cubs?
>>
>> Related trivia question -- what's the only franchise to *lose* more than
>> 10,000 games?
>
>That's easy -- the Phillies.

I am not a Sabrstician, and I have clearly gotten myself in way over my
head. Let me tell you what I know. My only sources are
http://mlb.mlb.com/NASApp/mlb/mlb/standings/index.jsp for 2004 and
http://www.baseball-reference.com/teams/ for everything prior.

Major league regular season totals
Giants 9962-8461
Cubs 9756-9203
Dodgers 9635-8717
Cardinals 9583-8972
Reds 9446-9115
Braves 9443-9484
Pirates 9422-9101
Yankees 9097-6962
Phillies 8591-9805

(Sumbuddy check my math.) According to this, no one has reached 10,000
either way. The Giants will hit 10,000 wins soon, followed by the Cubs,
Dodgers, and the rest of the National League. Though the Yankees have the
best won-lost percentage, they are way behind in total wins because they
are only 104 years old. They have passed only one 19th century team, and
surely that is a dubious distinction for the Phillies, but the Phillies
are still short of 10,000 defeats.

I don't have post season totals at hand. If you count post season wins,
the Giants reached 10,000 early this year. Well, maybe at the end of
2003. Can sumbuddy tell me if the Giants announced such a milestone?

Other sources of wins are highly dubious. There are spring training
games, post season exhibitions in Japan, and prior leagues. I think only
prior leagues are worthy of counting. My knowledge of other leagues is
pretty spotty. In fact the world's knowledge of other 19th Century
leagues is spotty. There's no doubt that the National League replaced the
National Association and absorbed several of it's teams, of which two
survived. The Atlanta Braves are directly descended from the NA Boston
Red Stockings (1871 to 1875). The Chicago Cubs are directly descended
from the NA Chicago White Stockings (1871, 1874, 1875).

Adding NA records we get:

Cubs 9833-9280
Braves 9668-9544

Which still leaves the Giants with the most wins. Whether the White
Stockings played in another league or played at all 1872 and 1873 is
beyond my knowledge. It's not listed by Baseball-Reference.com, but there
were dozens of minor leagues back then, most of which we have just bits of
knowledge about. Most teams which joined the National League in the 19th
Century had played the prior year in some other league. The Cincinnati
Reds try to claim lineage to a professional team which played in 1869, but
either there are gaps in their history or they played in two leagues in
the same year (which is possible). If we go reaching for history, the
Yankees have a nearly legitimate claim to the NL Baltimore Orioles
(1882-1899), which catapults them to over 10,000 wins.

For now I will stand on the statement that the Giants are 38 wins from
being the first major league team with 10,000 regular season wins. Beyond
that, I am clearly way out of my depth and I leave it to the Sabrsticians.
--
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